Vitamin B8 / Biotin in Food

[Kasper]

Vitamin B8 (biotin): Egg yolk, avocado, salmon, bananas, apples, mackerel and strawberries contain most vitamin B8.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1450323/

According to this study, banana's and apples are not a rich source of biotin.

Biotin content (ng biotin/g food) of select foods determined by HPLC/avidin binding assay:
Chicken liver, cooked 1872
Beef liver, cooked 416
Egg, yolk, cooked 272
Egg, whole, cooked 214
Peanuts, roasted, salted 175
Salmon, pink, canned in water 59
Egg, white, cooked 58
Almonds, roasted, salted 44.07
Walnuts, fresh 25.9
Pecans, fresh 20.0
Strawberries, fresh 15.0
Avocado, fresh 9.61
Tomatoes, fresh 7.01
Orange juice, canned, from concentrate 4.13
Banana, fresh 1.33
Apple, fresh 0.20

According this study this should be a more appropiate list:
Vitamin B8 (biotin): Egg yolk, salmon, allmonds, walnuts, pecans and strawberries contain most vitamin B8.
Although I'm not sure how cooking/roasting affects the values of egg yolks/salmon/almonds.
This study don't give any information of mackerel.
I don't know if chicken liver, beef liver are included in Wai Diet?

This study concludes that previously published values for biotin content of foods are likely to be inaccurate:

The differences between published values and values determined here may arise from one or more of the following: (1) Heterogeneity in foods assayed might have arisen from differences in growing conditions, biotin content of animal feeds or fertilizers, fortification, processing, season, and geographic location. Food samples presented here were not pooled from more than one source. (2) Analytical problems are likely to have contributed to the differences with respect to published values. Published biotin values likely both over- and underestimate true biotin content of particular foods because the majority of these studies used bioassays. Bioassays characteristically suffer from interference by unrelated substances, nonspecificity for biotin versus its metabolites, incomplete release of biotin from its protein-bound state, destruction of biotin during release from protein binding, and release of substances that cause assay artifacts during acid hydrolysis (Mock et al., 1992). Bioassays may measure ‘sparing factors’ and thereby overestimate biotin. Bioassays do not consistently discriminate biotin from its inactive metabolites. Biotin in food is largely protein bound to both endogenous and exogenous biotinyl proteins. The proportion of free (water extractable) biotin versus protein-bound (released by acidic or enzymatic hydrolysis) biotin varies among foods; the majority of biotin in meats and cereals appears to be protein bound (Zempleni and Mock, 1999). Furthermore, published biotin values rely heavily on values for compound foods reported by the food manufacturer (Pennington and Church, 1985; Pennington, 1989). These manufacturers do not necessarily specify methods for biotin analysis and may over- or underestimate biotin content in food values due to the same factors listed previously.

[zackcentury]

if published food values of biotin are so inaccurate, what can we conclude about the published intake recommendations?

USA recommended daily intake of biotin is up to 30 micrograms for adults, and supplements contain up to 300mcg.
I have read that adult recommendations are extrapolated from estimates for infants and children, and not determined by any overt study. This may be flawed because infants grow and adults do not. Also, I think the recommendations are influenced by "normal intake" values for someone on a "normal diet". Since these normal people are not obviously deficient, it is safe to assume that their intake of biotin is adequate.

So, according to this study, adults could meet current AI/RDA/DRI by eating 6-8 servings of yolk alone. I think the Wai diet assumes 20g/yolk, and this study assumes 15g/yolk... But I think the other important matter is that adequate intake values might also be flawed, and that consuming even a few yolks along with the recommended nuts will probably leave you more nourished than most of the crowd.

[Kasper]

I was thinking exactly the same.

The published intake recommendations are based on an average diet. And because such a diet has likely less biotin in it than previously thought, I think that those intake recommendations should also be lower.

[RRM]

I don't know if chicken liver, beef liver are included in Wai Diet?

Yes, but only in moderation (because of the vitamin A contents),
in as much as we advice not to consume more than a handful of Brazil nuts daily
(due to natural radioactivity).
The reason why avocado, apples and bananas are also mentioned in this 'biotin-supplying' list,
is because you usually consume them in much greater volumes than nuts and animal food,
making them a good source of biotin too.

Food Composition and Nutrition Tabels:
2 avocados contain 35 mcg biotin
1 kg of banana contains 55 mcg biotin
1 kg of apples contains 45 mcg biotin

Brazil nuts are preferred over other nuts because the protein quality is much higher,
which is beneficial in a low protein diet.

[Kasper]

Food Composition and Nutrition Tabels:
2 avocados contain 35 mcg biotin
1 kg of banana contains 55 mcg biotin
1 kg of apples contains 45 mcg biotin

But according to this study, this is not true:
banana: 1,3 ng/gram = 1,3 mcg/kg
apple: 0,2 ng/gram = 0,2 mcg /kg
avocado: 9,61 ng /gram = 3,33 mcg / 346 gram (2 units)

At least apples aren't a good source of biotin.
Relative to other studies banana and avocado are very low in biotin.
But relative to this study, it's not very low.

almonds: 44,07 ng/gram = 1,54 mcg/ 35 gram (one portion ?)
tomato: 7,01 ng / gram = 1,72 mcg / 246 gram (2 units, for one salad ? )
salmon: 59 ng/ gram = 5,9 mcg / 100 gram
Egg yolk: 272 ng/gram = 27,2 mcg / 100 gram (6 egg yolks)

[RRM]

But according to this study, this is not true:
banana: 1,3 ng/gram = 1,3 mcg/kg
apple: 0,2 ng/gram = 0,2 mcg /kg
avocado: 9,61 ng /gram = 3,33 mcg / 346 gram (2 units)

Thats one study. One method.
Food Composition and Nutrition Tabels is based on a large collection of studies.

At least apples aren't a good source of biotin.

This conclusion is based on one study.
Accepted and well established methods have shown differently.
Fruits such as apples, bananas and avocadoes are a good source of biotin.

Also:

Biotin deficiency is rare, because intestinal bacteria generally produce biotin in excess of the body's daily requirements. For that reason, statutory agencies in many countries, for example the USA[3] and Australia,[4] do not prescribe a recommended daily intake of biotin.
...
Biotin deficiency is relatively rare and mild, and can be addressed with supplementation. Such deficiency can be caused by the excessive consumption of raw egg whites (20 eggs/day would be required to induce it), which contain high levels of the protein avidin, which binds biotin strongly. Avidin is deactivated by cooking, while the biotin remains intact.
...
Symptoms of overt biotin deficiency include:

* Hair loss (alopecia)
* Conjunctivitis
* Dermatitis in the form of a scaly red rash around the eyes, nose, mouth, and genital area.
* Neurological symptoms in adults such as depression, lethargy, hallucination, and numbness and tingling of the extremities.

[Kasper]

Accepted and well established methods have shown differently.

Well, those published biotin values likely both over- and underestimate true biotin content of particular foods because the majority of these studies used bioassays.
Bioassays characteristically suffer from interference by unrelated substances, nonspecificity for biotin versus its metabolites, incomplete release of biotin from its protein-bound state, destruction of biotin during release from protein binding, and release of substances that cause assay artifacts during acid hydrolysis [1].
Bioassays may measure ‘sparing factors’ and thereby overestimate biotin. Bioassays do not consistently discriminate biotin from its inactive metabolites. Biotin in food is largely protein bound to both endogenous and exogenous biotinyl proteins. The proportion of free (water extractable) biotin versus protein-bound (released by acidic or enzymatic hydrolysis) biotin varies among foods; the majority of biotin in meats and cereals appears to be protein bound [2].
Furthermore, published biotin values rely heavily on values for compound foods reported by the food manufacturer [3][4]. These manufacturers do not necessarily specify methods for biotin analysis and may over- or underestimate biotin content in food values due to the same factors listed previously.

1. Mock DM, Mock NI, Langbehn SE. Biotin in human milk: methods, location, and chemical form. Journal of Nutrition. 1992;122:535–545
2. Zempleni J, Mock DM. Biotin biochemistry and human requirements. Journal of Nutrition and Biochemistry. 1999;10:128–138.
3. Pennington JAT, Church HN. Bowes and Church’s Food Values of Portions Commonly Used 14th Edition. Lippincott, Williams and Wilkins; Pennsylvania: 1985.
4. Pennington JAT. Bowes and Church’s Food Values of Portions Commonly Used 14th Edition. Lippincott Williams and Wilkins; Pennsylvania: 1989.

[RRM]

That is what it is: one study.
There are always disputes about what method is used best.
That doesnt make your particular study the right one.
Though you have repeated the claims of that study; you have not responded to the Wiki quotes.

[Kasper]

Though you have repeated the claims of that study; you have not responded to the Wiki quotes.

The wiki quotes are about biotin defiency.
But I don't think this diet is low in biotin.

This study suggests that this diet is lower in biotin than first thought.
But it suggest that practically every diet is lower in biotin than first thought.
Relative to other diets this diet is still high in biotin because of the egg yolks.
And as biotin deficiency is not common at all, it's very unlikely that this diet will lead to a biotin deficiency.

[RRM]

The wiki quotes are about biotin defiency.

They are also about that our own body may provide us with all the biotin that we need,
so that it may be irrelevant how much biotin our diet contains.

[Kasper]

They are also about that our own body may provide us with all the biotin that we need, so that it may be irrelevant how much biotin our diet contains.

Additionally, as many as 50% of pregnant women may be deficient in biotin, a deficiency that may increase the risk of birth defects. Preliminary research found laboratory evidence of biotin deficiency both in the early (first trimester) and late (third trimester) stages of pregnancy.

So for pregnant women it is not irrelevant how much biotin our diet contains.
Also people who suffer from symptoms that are associated with biotin deficiency might be interested in biotin rich food.
For them it's relevant how much biotin the diet contains.

Or for people who suffer from uncombable hair syndrome:
"We report a family affected to the fourth generation by uncombable hair syndrome. This syndrome is characterized by unruly, dry, blond hair with a tangled appearance. The family pedigree strongly supports the hypothesis of autosomal dominant inheritance; some members of the family had, apart from uncombable hair, minor signs of atopy and ectodermal dysplasia, such as abnormalities of the nails. The diagnosis was confirmed by means of extensive scanning electron microscopy. A trial with oral biotin 5 mg/day was started on two young patients with excellent results as regards the hair appearance, although scanning electron microscopy did not show structural changes in the hair. After a 2-year-period of follow-up, hair normality was maintained without biotin, while nail fragility still required biotin supplementation for control. "

I respect it if you stick to older publication for WaiDiet, that's your choice. But I do believe they give incorrect values.

One reason I came up with this is because my hair condition really improved after being on this diet.
Before this diet I had very strange straw coloured unhealthy looking hair. Not all of my hair, but just a couple, positioned more on front.
This was really frustrating because I could never get my hair in model, those unhealthy looking pieces were always doing what they wanted to do, no matter how much wax or gel I used.
After being on Wai, all of those became healthy looking hair ! Thank you for that RRM!
That was one reason why despite I don't suffer from acne (well maybe a little bit , but not like frustrating), I've sticked to this diet for 7 months in a row from the moment I started.
But now I've been 4/5 four weeks on holiday in Maroc and what do you think? They are back, those fucking bustards !

Okay, long story, but the point is this:
Before I was on Wai, I was on a vegan raw food diet. I ate lots of banana's and other fruits (and raw cacao, chlorella and more of that sort not good tasting food, bleeh )
From your sources, 5 banana's already give you enough biotin for a day (30 mcg), (if for some reason your intestinal bacteria aren't able to give you enough biotin, the study above shows that this could also be through genetic factors).

Those 5 banana's didn't help me at all, but this wai diet with 6/10 egg yolks gave me amazing results !
That's one reason, besides the arguments given by the study itself, I believe that the values of biotin in this study are more appropriate.

It might be no empirical evidence, but I like to share this experience I have had.

[Oscar]

A bit off-topic: what were your experiences on a vegan (raw) diet, Kasper?

[RRM]

WHFoods: "Additionally, as many as 50% of pregnant women may be deficient in biotin"

What women are you talking about?
What country?
What is the source?

Or for people who suffer from uncombable hair syndrome:

How much biotin food actually contains, is disputed, and may be irrelevant for normal healthy people.
To the USDA its even so much irrelevant that they dont give any data about biotin at all.
If somebody reports to suffer from uncombable hair syndrome, then it may be relevant...

I do believe they give incorrect values.

Based on 1 study?
I will change our data when official databases change their data.
They have more insight as to what studies are relevant, i think.

After being on Wai, all of those became healthy looking hair !

Thats great. Congratulations!

but this wai diet with 6/10 egg yolks gave me amazing results !

Egg yolks are high in a lot more than just biotin.
Maybe you suffered from insufficient cholesterol, B2, B5, B9, B12, K1, D, specific omega fats, iron or zinc...

[djkvan]

[EDIT by RRM] Moved from another thread [/EDIT]

I actually find the combination of white and yolk to taste quite good and mild when gently stirred together.

[dime]

As far as I know, even a little white has enough avidin to deactivate the biotin in the yolk. If you don't mind that then I guess it shouldn't be a problem if you get some white in.

From http://articles.mercola.com/sites/artic ... -eggs.aspx

However, recently a subscriber, Dr. Sharma, PhD, who is a biochemist with Bayer, contacted me about this issue. His investigation into the matter revealed that there is not enough biotin in an egg yolk to bind to all the avidin present in the raw whites. He found that 5.7 grams of biotin are required to neutralize all the avidin found in the raw whites of an average-sized egg. There are only about 25 micrograms -- or 25 millionths of a gram -- of biotin in an average egg yolk.